Hearing Gods Will

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Re: Hearing Gods Will

Postby positrac » Fri Jun 02, 2017 3:15 am

D'oh wrote:You missed my meaning.

If God ever called me on the phone, I would probably hang up!


Means that If God ever Verbally/Directly communicated to me, I would still have a hard time believing it to be God. (not some telemarketer). Perhaps, being Alcoholic, Self Centered to Extreme, makes me over think everything.

This was even tested. Shortly after I actually got a call asking if "I was the President, they needed a ride to Church". It stumped me for awhile, before I figured out it was the wrong number.

he he! read you loud and clear on your reply. See I really would rather see that burning bush mentioned in the old testament as seeing is believing! Faith is another deal and so for me I have to have faith that I am in the right place at the right time to get this message.

Over thinking!!!! Sounds like women right? But I know I am just as bad if not worse on this trait and I believe if I turn over issues and listen (means to shut up mentally and find quiet) I know a message will be revealed. It is weird but I drove for a living and so I'd stop for some go-go juice and eat some driver might say some obscure thing and it might take me 100 miles for that message to light me up and then I'd know that God as I understood him just provided me with that burning bush.

I totally agree with how you stated this reply as it is real and I think..... my expectations might not match others results in this area, or did they----->over thinking again! I gotta get out of my way for this to work. :lol:
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Re: Hearing Gods Will

Postby avaneesh912 » Fri Jun 02, 2017 4:12 am

Is very Lightly Worded. Without the "Way Out described in the BB, I would not have a Family, Home, Job, Sanity. I have been there done that. Perhaps why I sometimes place Meetings ahead of nights at home with the Family, take time off work to talk with someone in need. Because if I were still active, I probably wouldn't have the option anyways.


Did you not read the rest of my post?

Also, You think, you relapsed, because you stopped going to meetings you drank. Is it possible you also not take care of the internal conditions? Allowed resentments creep in? And then got shut off from the sunlight of the spirit?
Show him, from your own experience, how the peculiar mental condition surrounding that first drink prevents normal functioning of the will power (Alcoholics Anonymous, Page 92)
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Re: Hearing Gods Will

Postby D'oh » Fri Jun 02, 2017 5:20 am

Also, You think, you relapsed, because you stopped going to meetings you drank. Is it possible you also not take care of the internal conditions? Allowed resentments creep in? And then got shut off from the sunlight of the spirit?


Most definitely, it isn't a Drink Problem, but a Life Problem. But it is not like I just shut off the "God Conscience Switch". But I didn't "Pause when agitated or doubtful" I didn't "Constantly remind myself, I was no longer running the Show".

"Self reliance was good, as far as it went, but it doesn't go far enough"
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Re: Hearing Gods Will

Postby avaneesh912 » Fri Jun 02, 2017 5:56 am

But I didn't "Pause when agitated or doubtful" I didn't "Constantly remind myself, I was no longer running the Show".


So, you think going to a meeting everyday is going to give you this discipline? I need the power the rest of the 23 hours. I am not saying we stop going to meetings. This insistence of being in a meeting every day is what is I can't reconcile with. The 4th dimension of living is circumventing and facing problems with ease.
Show him, from your own experience, how the peculiar mental condition surrounding that first drink prevents normal functioning of the will power (Alcoholics Anonymous, Page 92)
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Re: Hearing Gods Will

Postby D'oh » Fri Jun 02, 2017 9:52 am

I have never said "Everyday" only the importance of Attending Meetings.

The numbers needed will be revealed if of course one is "Tuned In". Just this week I was convincing myself to kick back at home Weds. Night when I got a text for a ride to it.

The Meeting turned out to be a 11th Step Reading, which is the basis of this very thread.
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Re: Hearing Gods Will

Postby PaigeB » Fri Jun 02, 2017 10:43 am

"Self reliance was good, as far as it went, but it doesn't go far enough"

And I can't rely solely on my sponsor to keep me "tuned in".

I can't look it up right now but there is a place in the BB where it says that we think we know God's will and pay for it in all sort of heinous actions and ideas... think of the people who deny their children food or medical care based on what their god "told them".

My brain ran on self control for a long long time, I will not live as long as I drank. I cannot trust that the things that come to my brain are of a divine source and not my ego.

Why not use meetings as a way to stay "tapped into the unsuspected inner resource"?
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Re: Hearing Gods Will

Postby Brock » Fri Jun 02, 2017 12:39 pm

...there is a place in the BB where it says that we think we know God's will and pay for it in all sort of heinous actions and ideas...

I will quote it -
Being still inexperienced and having just made conscious contact with God, it is not probable that we are going to be inspired at all times. We might pay for this presumption in all sorts of absurd actions and ideas.

But it says “being still inexperienced,” so what happens when we gain experience, this is right after those lines quoted -
Nevertheless, we find that our thinking will, as time passes, be more and more on the plane of inspiration. We come to rely upon it.

Come to rely on it! If they thought we should rely on meetings or sponsor or whatever, they would have at least mentioned that, but not even a hint of it we see. And I don't find much wrong with those who say that's where they find their strength, or stay tapped in, my problem is I feel those folks have a duty to tell newcomers, and particularly those they sponsor, that some others are able to lock into the power to the extent that meetings become optional, and in my experience they don't say that. So others like myself say it in meetings and on forums like these.
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Re: Hearing Gods Will

Postby avaneesh912 » Fri Jun 02, 2017 12:59 pm

"tapped into the unsuspected inner resource"?


Inner Resource.

Why not use the meetings to stay tapped? Doesn't make sense to me. Sorry.
Show him, from your own experience, how the peculiar mental condition surrounding that first drink prevents normal functioning of the will power (Alcoholics Anonymous, Page 92)
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Re: Hearing Gods Will

Postby D'oh » Fri Jun 02, 2017 4:10 pm

Come to rely on it! If they thought we should rely on meetings or sponsor or whatever, they would have at least mentioned that, but not even a hint of it we see.

But it does not say "We become Self Reliant on what His Will for Us is"

As we go through the day we pause, when agitated or doubtful, and ask for the right thought or action. We constantly remind ourselves we are no longer
running the show, humbly saying to ourselves many times each day “Thy will be done.” We are then in much less danger of excitement, fear, anger, worry, self-pity, or foolish decisions. We become much more efficient. We do not tire so easily, for we are not burning up energy foolishly as we did when we were trying to arrange life to suit ourselves.


In fact, it clearly says to ask others for assistance from Religious People, in a Spiritual Program.

Be quick to see where religious people are right. Make use of what they offer.


It in No Way says that Your contact is and will be right.

Actually, starting from
We feel a man is unthinking when he says that sobriety is enough. He is like the farmer who came up out of his cyclone cellar to find his home ruined. To his wife, he remarked, “Don’t see anything the matter here, Ma. Ain’t it grand the wind stopped blowin’?”

To the quotes above (6 pages) should be read in 2 parts, in Whole Form. Not parts and quotes, for the full meaning.
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Re: Hearing Gods Will

Postby avaneesh912 » Sat Jun 03, 2017 5:20 am

But I didn't "Pause when agitated or doubtful" I didn't "Constantly remind myself, I was no longer running the Show".


Constantly remind myself. Yes. Thats a discipline we have to cultivate. Thats also the main reason why the book talks about "the defense must come from a higher power" (last paragraph of page 43 from the big book).

Nobody in between. My sponsor can't help me, the people in the network can't help me. When the S*** hits the roof, the consciousness, awareness, GOD, HP whatever we call it, is what is going to shed some sanity in those situations. We pause, we forgive ourselves or others and move on.
Show him, from your own experience, how the peculiar mental condition surrounding that first drink prevents normal functioning of the will power (Alcoholics Anonymous, Page 92)
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Re: Hearing Gods Will

Postby Brock » Sat Jun 03, 2017 6:35 am

To the quotes above (6 pages) should be read in 2 parts, in Whole Form. Not parts and quotes, for the full meaning.

I agree with that, and just read it again. But the part “Ain't it grand the wind stopped blowing,” is to me the 'warning' not to just say good I don't feel to drink anymore, (wind stopped, storm over), no need for all this spiritual stuff, it says after that "The spiritual life is not a theory. We have to live it." (And he hardly uses those italics, it's for important stuff).
But it does not say "We become Self Reliant on what His Will for Us is"

Maybe not in those words, but it says something close, and we have to take bits and pieces of quotes, like these -
Under these conditions we can employ our mental faculties with assurance, for after all God gave us brains to use... What used to be the hunch or the occasional inspiration gradually becomes a working part of the mind...We come to rely upon it.

What I am pushing for is the idea to at least try to find the motive behind our thinking, before asking someone their opinion. It even says when we pause “we ask for the right thought or action,” not hello sponsor, but hello God. Just the relaxation of even less than a minute in silent meditation can bring the answers - “We relax and take it easy. We don’t struggle. We are often surprised how the right answers come after we have tried this for a while.” Even in the 12 & 12 step 10, where they talk about progress not perfection, we see this - “In all these situations we need self-restraint, honest analysis of what is involved, a willingness to admit when the fault is ours, and an equal willingness to forgive when the fault is elsewhere. We need not be discouraged when we fall into the error of our old ways, for these disciplines are not easy.” It says honest analysis, not hello sponsor analyze this, we must try to analyze ourselves.

It in No Way says that Your contact is and will be right.

In fact, it clearly says to ask others for assistance from Religious People, in a Spiritual Program.

But it does say it - “We are often surprised how the right answers come after we have tried this for a while.”

Those religious people who might help, I don't think the writers were talking about the average Joe in a meeting or our sponsors. Bill was very keen on sticking close to preachers, and speaks about Rev. Sam Shoemaker as being the biggest influence in the forming of AA. His other advisers include the Catholic priest Fr. Ed Dowling, who he quotes in the first line of step 6 in the12 & 12, Emmett Fox was big with him as well, he used to take groups to listen to him preach at the Hippodrome, now the Madison Square Garden. If he was alive today, I bet he would say we should listen to spiritual people on you tube, or read from the hundreds of free spiritual books on Google, we are luckier than they were then.

As I have said, whatever works is fine, but members of AA should realize that the growth in the program comes in the practice of step 11, and we are not looking to become saints. My favorite part is 'we relax and take it easy,' and yet I have heard of sponsors who tell their sponsees that they must kneel down, one shouted out in a meeting saying that if you don't kneel you are a selfish bugger, with no respect for God. I say it's a deeply personal step and nobody can say what's right or wrong, if it feels right do it, and feeling right to me is feeling peaceful and at ease.

Even today’s reflection tells us where to look to find God's will -
It's not easy to know God's will in each circumstance. I must search out and be ready for the currents, and that's where prayer and meditation help!
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Re: Hearing Gods Will

Postby D'oh » Sat Jun 03, 2017 3:13 pm

Nobody in between. My sponsor can't help me, the people in the network can't help me. When the S*** hits the roof, the consciousness, awareness, GOD, HP whatever we call it, is what is going to shed some sanity in those situations. We pause, we forgive ourselves or others and move on.


If my "Own conscience contact with a HP was on the right path, would I even be in the situation?"

But it does say it - “We are often surprised how the right answers come after we have tried this for a while.”


It also says, "Conversations with others"

When we retire at night, we constructively review our day. Were we resentful, selfish, dishonest or afraid? Do we owe an apology? Have we kept something to ourselves which should be discussed with another person at once?


So not only an Apology, (to the one affected) but also Another Person?
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Re: Hearing Gods Will

Postby avaneesh912 » Sun Jun 04, 2017 6:53 am

If my "Own conscience contact with a HP was on the right path, would I even be in the situation?"


We are going in circles. I can't hide in the rooms 24/7. Sometimes, I may be forced to skip a meeting a day or two. For example my wife does not comfortable when I go to meetings when we are vacation. So last weekend, I didn't have any meetings. When I am in India, I may attend 2 meetings in 3 weeks time period. Meditation and for me chanting mantras keeps me closer to GOD than what I hear in meetings.

What i am trying say is, this is program of action. we apply the disciplines when we need it. I can't afford to lose my marbles by argueing. Thats why books says grouch and brainstorm are dubious luxury of a normal man. That we learn by reading the big book or if you get lucky, if you have BB meetings in your area, you may hear that. But then we got to practice that when we need that most.
Show him, from your own experience, how the peculiar mental condition surrounding that first drink prevents normal functioning of the will power (Alcoholics Anonymous, Page 92)
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Re: Hearing Gods Will

Postby PaigeB » Sun Jun 04, 2017 10:15 am

avaneesh912 wrote:
"tapped into the unsuspected inner resource"?


Inner Resource.

Why not use the meetings to stay tapped? Doesn't make sense to me. Sorry.

Oops - That is a quote from the Big Book. The reader is referred to it by asterisk on pg 27 & pg 47 of the basic text. In the 4th Edition it is page 567 and is a good read, little more than a quick page and a half.
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Re: Hearing Gods Will

Postby D'oh » Sun Jun 04, 2017 10:30 am

We are going in circles. I can't hide in the rooms 24/7. Sometimes, I may be forced to skip a meeting a day or two. For example my wife does not comfortable when I go to meetings when we are vacation. So last weekend, I didn't have any meetings. When I am in India, I may attend 2 meetings in 3 weeks time period. Meditation and for me chanting mantras keeps me closer to GOD than what I hear in meetings.

What i am trying say is, this is program of action. we apply the disciplines when we need it. I can't afford to lose my marbles by argueing. Thats why books says grouch and brainstorm are dubious luxury of a normal man. That we learn by reading the big book or if you get lucky, if you have BB meetings in your area, you may hear that. But then we got to practice that when we need that most.


I think we are saying the same thing.

I am saying "Meetings are important source of staying on a HP's path" Other People's Opinions matter.

You, from what I understand, are saying "Life can be handled, with a Conscience Contact with a Higher Power" (which I can agree on) Meetings not as important as being in Contact with a HP.

Am I correct?

What I am trying to get across, is "Over time, living with one's Own Concept of God's Will, can be Very Dangerous, to one with the Self Centered Mind of an Alcoholic."

OP's Shares, opinions, struggles and stories all help keep me straight. Sometimes even the bad shares, hold the most help. The program is our's to use and keep, as long as we pass it to those who still suffer. If for no other reason than to share the best possible advice, I must keep working on myself.

Spiritual Progress, not Spiritual Perfection. God will constantly disclose more to you and to us. We ought to be there to hear it.
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