Mental state that precedes a relapse!

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Re: Mental state that precedes a relapse!

Postby avaneesh912 » Thu Feb 09, 2017 3:32 pm

The first step is the most important step they say. It has to be realized at a deep deep level that alcohol is not going to fix any of our problem. And then we work towards staying selfless. By not letting selfishness-self-centeredness creep back in, these thoughts shouldn't impact us. Bear in mind, these are just thoughts. But, if we let it turn into obsession, I wouldn't even by writing this post.
Show him, from your own experience, how the peculiar mental condition surrounding that first drink prevents normal functioning of the will power (Alcoholics Anonymous, Page 92)
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Re: Mental state that precedes a relapse!

Postby Noels » Thu Feb 09, 2017 9:35 pm

Good morning :) excellent thoughts on this subject. Thanks everyone. Have a fabulous Friday
Mwah xxx
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Re: Mental state that precedes a relapse!

Postby Spirit Flower » Sat Feb 11, 2017 1:49 pm

Today I heard in a meeting. There are 12 steps for recovery and 4 steps to drink.

Check out page 66. The 4 steps look like this:
1. harbor resentments
2. shut off from the sunlight of the spirit
3. the insanity returns
4. we drink again

This is one of the pieces. We think there are "strange mental blank spots" (page 42) but really, those 4 steps co-exist.

But if you want to drink right now, go to page 35 where it says "What sort of thinking dominates an alcoholic who repeats time after time the desperate experiment of the first drink?" Read to the end of the chapter and see if the desire to drink is not gone.
...a score card reading zero...
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Re: Mental state that precedes a relapse!

Postby ezdzit247 » Wed Feb 15, 2017 2:56 pm

The relapse started some time before the 1st drink seems logical but this information doesn't do me much good because if alcoholics could recognize their mental state that precedes the first drink, nobody would relapse.


Precisely.
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Re: Mental state that precedes a relapse!

Postby Brock » Thu Feb 16, 2017 4:47 am

The relapse started some time before the 1st drink seems logical but this information doesn't do me much good because if alcoholics could recognize their mental state that precedes the first drink, nobody would relapse.

Precisely.

Nonsense – Word used by English people to express contempt or disagreement. Moderator edit

Throughout our literature we see promises and indicators of how we will feel after we recover, we were encouraged by these to do the work required, and use them to encourage others, and now we will turn around and say that we can't even recognize when we are no longer on the broad highway.

We sometimes see folks putting up lists of the principles attached to each step, these vary according to each persons viewpoint, but always seem to contain things like honesty, patience, humility, faith, courage and of course service. You really want to tell us that we won't recognize when we are becoming impatient with others, or dishonest, or our fears are to the point that faith and courage are no longer present.

No, the only people who will not recognize when these qualities are slipping away, are those who never acquired them in the first place.
"Good morning, this is your Higher Power speaking. I will not be needing your help today."
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Re: Mental state that precedes a relapse!

Postby Reborn » Thu Feb 16, 2017 10:28 am

I agree Brock...The big book gives us things to do to prevent these types of things..

Page 84...

This thought brings us to Step Ten, which suggests we continue to take personal inventory and continue to set right any new mistakes as we go along. We vigorously commenced this way of living as we cleaned up the past. We have entered the world of the Spirit. Our next function is to grow in understanding and effectiveness. This is not an overnight matter. It should continue for our lifetime. Continue to watch for selfishness, dishonesty, resentment, and fear. When these crop up, we ask God at once to remove them. We discuss them with someone immediately and make amends quickly if we have harmed anyone. Then we resolutely turn our thoughts to someone we can help. Love and tolerance of others is our code.

Then it goes a little deeper on 86...

When we retire at night, we constructively review our day. Were we resentful, selfish, dishonest or afraid? Do we owe an apology? Have we kept something to ourselves which should be discussed with another person at once? Were we kind and loving toward all? What could we have done better? Were we thinking of ourselves most of the time? Or were we thinking of what we could do for others, of what we could pack into the stream of life? But we must be careful not to drift into worry, remorse or morbid reflection, for that would diminish our usefulness to others. After making our review we ask God's forgiveness and inquire what corrective measures should be taken.

Once a person has a spiritual awakening as the result of the steps and continues to do the above EVERYDAY the possibility of drinking should never enter the mind...and if it does we recoil from it. I don't know it seems pretty simple...just carefully follow directions and you can have a life beyond what you thought possible. In almost every case I have personally seen...the folks that "relapse" stop doing what works. A good friend of mine says it well..."When I feel disturbed its because I did something I should've done or there was something I needed to do and didn't"(refering to the steps). It is all laid out for us right there in black and white...hint...read the black parts.
We have recovered, and have been given the power to help others. BB pg 132
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Re: Mental state that precedes a relapse!

Postby Noels » Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:38 am

"black and white...hint...read the black parts."

I'm just wondering .... what if the person is color blind?

:lol: :lol: :lol: teasing you Reborn :lol: :lol: :lol:

have a good evening xxx :lol:
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Re: Mental state that precedes a relapse!

Postby PaigeB » Thu Feb 16, 2017 3:02 pm

Spirit Flower wrote:Today I heard in a meeting. There are 12 steps for recovery and 4 steps to drink.

Check out page 66. The 4 steps look like this:
1. harbor resentments
2. shut off from the sunlight of the spirit
3. the insanity returns
4. we drink again

This is one of the pieces. We think there are "strange mental blank spots" (page 42) but really, those 4 steps co-exist.

But if you want to drink right now, go to page 35 where it says "What sort of thinking dominates an alcoholic who repeats time after time the desperate experiment of the first drink?" Read to the end of the chapter and see if the desire to drink is not gone.

GOOD STUFF!
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Re: Mental state that precedes a relapse!

Postby michmjon » Thu Feb 16, 2017 7:10 pm

We had a very interesting meeting this morning. One of the relatively new members of the group who moved here from across country (sober from alcohol for 5 years and from drugs for only a year) wanted to discuss something other than the Step 2 reading and talk instead about how depression is driving him to a mental state he really doesn't want to be in and that he was in a conundrum about getting out of that state. He pointed to one of the many signs on the wall...

"But we aren't a glum lot. If newcomers could see no joy or fun in our existence, they wouldn't want it. We absolutely insist on enjoying life."

Then he went on to say that lately when he goes to meetings all he hears is "Gloom, Doom and Agony on Me" and it was REALLY starting to depress him. On one hand he knows that meetings are his salvation and his last hope to remain clean, but on the other the hand he was dragging himself to meetings he didn't really want to go to because they were just flat-out depressing him. He pointed to the sign again and said "But we ARE a glum lot!" The next speaker blamed it on the post-holiday winter blues, long nights, days with no sun, etc. The next two people (who NEVER pass at meetings) passed. When my turn rolled around, I agreed with our newcomer 100%- lately we had been a very glum lot. A bunch of old souls sitting around a table, sipping on stale coffee and eating day-old donuts, complaining about our health, the local economy, our children and our spouses then ending the rant with "but not for the grace of God and taking things one day at a time, I remain sober." I challenged every one to go around the table one more time and just to say something nice- be it about their life, another person at the table- whatever- just make it something NICE!

Too often I see meetings disintegrate into sob stories and tales of woe and misery- granted I live in a very depressed area- but still. No one wants to stop and smell the roses, to greet the day with a smile and go out with nothing but intentions of good towards others. If you think life's a pile of sh*t- guess what! Life will be a pile of sh*t! We must absolutely insist on enjoying life!
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Re: Mental state that precedes a relapse!

Postby D'oh » Thu Feb 16, 2017 8:10 pm

I always try to be Cheery at meetings, remembering the relief I was granted at my first meeting.

As for a Mental State, I have and haven't caught myself both by building, coddling, caressing, flaming. Many little issues in the attempt to build the flame high enough to say "Screw It, what's the use anyways" I have also had things go so great that I forgot where it was I came from.

Cunning, baffling, powerful. Now I do a lot of meetings (keep the tank full). I do the 10th step daily/hourly/ minute by minute if needed. And never forget that it is a Gift, granted to me to use anyway I feel, but I don't own sobriety.
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Re: Mental state that precedes a relapse!

Postby Noels » Fri Feb 17, 2017 4:10 am

No one wants to stop and smell the roses, to greet the day with a smile and go out with nothing but intentions of good towards others. If you think life's a pile of sh*t- guess what! Life will be a pile of sh*t! We must absolutely insist on enjoying life!
 
Absolutely! I agree with you 575%! Whether to be miserable or happy is totally my choice. I choose to be happy.
Have an awesome weekend! :D
Mwah xxxxxxxxxx Stax of kisses for YOU today!!! :D
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Re: Mental state that precedes a relapse!

Postby michmjon » Fri Feb 17, 2017 9:36 am

Noels wrote:No one wants to stop and smell the roses, to greet the day with a smile and go out with nothing but intentions of good towards others. If you think life's a pile of sh*t- guess what! Life will be a pile of sh*t! We must absolutely insist on enjoying life!
 
Absolutely! I agree with you 575%! Whether to be miserable or happy is totally my choice. I choose to be happy.
Have an awesome weekend! :D
Mwah xxxxxxxxxx Stax of kisses for YOU today!!! :D
Noels


And what just happened at today's meeting? =surprised =biggrin =biggrin =biggrin =biggrin =biggrin

Gloom, despair, and agony on me
Deep, dark depression, excessive misery
If it weren't for bad luck, I'd have no luck at all
Gloom, despair, and agony on me

This morning I got to speak to my very best friend Fred
He called me on the telephone, and this is what he said:
"I'm sorry to have to tell you this, but we think your friend is DEAD!
He got into a tiger fight, last night at lonesome Red's!"

"You see, your friend Old Al, likes sittin' at the bar,
An' when he gets to drinkin', he sometimes goes too far!
Well, last night there was somethin' grand, a woman beyond compare!
And Old Al got to singin' loud; and howling in the air!"

"That girl had a boyfriend who was the scariest one I seen!:
Some great strip-ed tiger man, with teeth, and looks so mean!
I think his name was Tony, and he was up from Battle Creek,
Old Al shoulda ate his Wheaties 'cause that Tiger's strength was Grrrreat!

"Last thing I saw was Tony Tiger, laying down the law,
Giving Old Al such a what-for, Like nothing I ever saw!
Well I guess Old Ai's still alive, but you'd better come on down,
The Sheriff finally caught 'em and he put him in the pound!"

Gloom, despair, and agony on me
Deep, dark depression, excessive misery
If it weren't for bad luck, I'd have no luck at all
Gloom, despair, and agony on me!
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Re: Mental state that precedes a relapse!

Postby Noels » Fri Feb 17, 2017 10:14 am

oh shoooossss :shock: :shock: :shock: (cant say the other word anymore. Nor the normal pair of shoos on our feet as it gets deleted as a swearword =geek) was that good or bad? I'm too afraid to let my mind "run" with it right now til I get the definite answer :shock:
Mwah xxxx
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Re: Mental state that precedes a relapse!

Postby Reborn » Fri Feb 17, 2017 10:26 am

Then he went on to say that lately when he goes to meetings all he hears is "Gloom, Doom and Agony on Me" and it was REALLY starting to depress him. On one hand he knows that meetings are his salvation and his last hope to remain clean, but on the other the hand he was dragging himself to meetings he didn't really want to go to because they were just flat-out depressing him. He pointed to the sign again and said "But we ARE a glum lot!" The next speaker blamed it on the post-holiday winter blues, long nights, days with no sun, etc. The next two people (who NEVER pass at meetings) passed. When my turn rolled around, I agreed with our newcomer 100%- lately we had been a very glum lot. A bunch of old souls sitting around a table, sipping on stale coffee and eating day-old donuts, complaining about our health, the local economy, our children and our spouses then ending the rant with "but not for the grace of God and taking things one day at a time, I remain sober." I challenged every one to go around the table one more time and just to say something nice- be it about their life, another person at the table- whatever- just make it something NICE!


So the guy who has been sober off alcohol for 5 years and drugs for 1 has been sober for just that one year. I can't believe no one talked about the program of action laid out for us in the Big Book. I would've told this dude to stop blaming meetings and people in them and look at the causes and conditions of this depression. Folks who think meetings are their salvation have it wrong...the program of action in the 12 steps is our salvation. I go to alot of meetings where there is talk of doom and gloom...but I continue to share the SOLUTION...because that is what I'm there to do. If your life is a S*** storm close your mouth.
We have recovered, and have been given the power to help others. BB pg 132
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Re: Mental state that precedes a relapse!

Postby Noels » Fri Feb 17, 2017 2:07 pm

12/27/08 A vision for you BB pp 159-161 (the meeting)
by Karl R » Sat Dec 27, 2008 2:42 pm
Good Day,

God grant me the serenity
to accept the things I cannot change;
courage to change the things I can;
and wisdom to know the difference.

Yesterday's reading spoke of identification between alcoholics as one of the building blocks of the fellowship in AA.

Today's reading speaks of the spirit of the first AA gatherings.

Though they knew they must help other alcoholics if they would remain sober, that motive became secondary. It was transcended by the happiness they found in giving themselves for others.

They experienced a few distressing failures, but in those cases they made an effort to bring the man's family into a spiritual way of living, thus relieving much worry and suffering.

it became customary to set apart one night a week for a meeting to be attended by anyone or everyone interested in a spiritual way of life. Aside from fellowship and sociability, the prime object was to provide a time and place where new people might bring their problems.




All this time our friend of the hotel lobby incident remained in that town. He was there three months. He now returned home, leaving behind his first acquaintance, the lawyer and the devil-may-care chap. These men had found something brand new in life. Though they knew they must help other alcoholics if they would remain sober, that motive became secondary. It was transcended by the happiness they found in giving themselves for others. They shared their homes, their slender resources, and gladly devoted their spare hours to fellow-sufferers. They were willing, by day or night, to place a new man in the hospital and visit him afterward. They grew in numbers. They experienced a few distressing failures, but in those cases they made an effort to bring the man's family into a spiritual way of living, thus relieving much worry and suffering.
A year and six months later these three had succeeded with seven more. Seeing much of each other, scarce an evening passed that someone's home did not shelter a little gathering of men and women, happy in their release, and constantly thinking how they might present their discovery to some newcomer. In addition to these casual get-togethers, it became customary to set apart one night a week for a meeting to be attended by anyone or everyone interested in a spiritual way of life. Aside from fellowship and sociability, the prime object was to provide a time and place where new people might bring their problems.
Outsiders became interested. One man and his wife placed their large home at the disposal of this strangely assorted crowd. This couple has since become so fascinated that they have dedicated their home to the work. Many a distracted wife has visited this house to find loving and understanding companionship among women who knew her problem, to hear from the lips of their husbands what had happened to them, to be advised how her own wayward mate might be hospitalized and approached when next he stumbled.
Many a man, yet dazed from his hospital experience, has stepped over the threshold of that home into freedom. Many an alcoholic who entered there came away with an answer. He succumbed to that gay crowd inside, who laughed at their own misfortunes and understood his. Impressed by those who visited him at the hospital, he capitulated entirely when, later, in an upper room of this house, he heard the story of some man whose experience closely tallied with his own. The expression on the faces of the women, that indefinable something in the eyes of the men, the stimulating and electric atmosphere of the place,conspired to let him know that here was haven at last.
The very practical approach to his problems, the absence of intolerance of any kind, the informality, the genuine democracy, the uncanny understanding which these people had were irresistible. He and his wife would leave elated by the thought of what they could now do for some stricken acquaintance and his family. They knew they had a host of new friends; it seemed they had known these strangers always. They had seen miracles, and one was to come to them. They had visioned the Great Reality - their loving and All Powerful Creator.
Now, this house will hardly accommodate its weekly visitors, for they number sixty or eighty as a rule. Alcoholics are being attracted from far and near. From surrounding towns, families drive long distances to be present. A community thirty miles away has fifteen fellows of Alcoholics Anonymous. Being a large place, we think that some day its Fellowship will number many hundreds.
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