Heard at the District Meeting!

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Re: Heard at the District Meeting!

Postby PaigeB » Mon Apr 04, 2016 11:23 am

Stepchild wrote:
PaigeB wrote:I thought sash was the curtain, but that is a real image, either way.

I often hear alcoholics refer to this desire to die rather than suffer drunk or sober. It is the "jumping off" place? Do or die?


Thoughts of dying rather than continuing like that. I went to a doctor complaining of anxiety...He prescribed something...I continued to drink with it...Finally getting so bad I gave up the pills. I couldn't stomach a peanut butter sandwich at the end of my drinking. Way underweight. This was spot on for me.


ME TOO! To all of that! :)

(went to quote you and hit edit my mistake, I made no changes...)
If I'm not able to say how I'm working my program today, then I'm not working my program.
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Re: Heard at the District Meeting!

Postby Stepchild » Mon Apr 04, 2016 11:24 am

Back to Avaneesh's topic...The Big Book won't be going anywhere. I didn't even realize there were Steps for Dummies books...I did read the Little Book...The 12 and 12...Drop the Rock was very helpful for steps 6 and 7. I listened to Joe and Charlie...Other step speakers...Went to Big Book meetings....Most important thing I ever did...I asked for help. I wasn't big on that.
I think what this program comes down to is...What lengths are you willing to go to to get it?
That to me is the most important thing that we can't give to a suffering alcoholic...Willingness.
I strongly believe that only alcohol can give them that.
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Re: Heard at the District Meeting!

Postby Stepchild » Mon Apr 04, 2016 11:26 am

PaigeB wrote:ME TOO! To all of that! :)


I've come to find out...We aren't alone on that.
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Re: Heard at the District Meeting!

Postby PaigeB » Mon Apr 04, 2016 11:31 am

That to me is the most important thing that we can't give to a suffering alcoholic...Willingness.
I strongly believe that only alcohol can give them that.

The gift of desperation... and we have a solution. I wouldn't change a word, even if I complain about a few of them!
If I'm not able to say how I'm working my program today, then I'm not working my program.
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Re: Heard at the District Meeting!

Postby Db1105 » Tue Apr 05, 2016 4:17 am

I wished there would of been an updated companion book available when I came into the Fellowship back it the late '70's. It was a tough read because of the outdated language back then.
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Re: Heard at the District Meeting!

Postby Noels » Tue Apr 05, 2016 6:17 am

In the beginning I struggled a bit with the Big Book as is but that could be because my brain was still foggy for a while. I also struggled with short term memory and concentration.
Now I quite like the way Bill wrote. The story I heard at my old group (don't know how true) was that Bill was a lawyer and those days (and today still mind you), it was frowned upon for lawyers to use the same word twice in a letter/brief as you were then considered dumb. :lol: The story sort of makes sense if I take this into consideration while reading as Ive noticed that use of different words meaning the exact same thing is quite obvious.
So I like the big book as it is written now. However, if another book is written containing the same message but easier understandable language and BOTH is available I don't have a problem with that. As long as it saves lives I'm okay with it.
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Re: Heard at the District Meeting!

Postby PaigeB » Tue Apr 05, 2016 11:31 am

I think Bill dropped out of law school. He was actually a self made man as a stockbroker. Still, he may have gotten his writing skills/finesse from ideas with the law.

I was a legal assistant my career... but I was a writer long before that and did not care for repeated words. It makes the use of semantics, replacing one words with another, ie AA for god, easier for me. I already have practice.
If I'm not able to say how I'm working my program today, then I'm not working my program.
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Re: Heard at the District Meeting!

Postby ezdzit247 » Tue Apr 05, 2016 1:14 pm

I can't imagine AA's GSO ever even entertaining the idea of re-writing or changing one word of what Bill wrote. If there's a *** problem among some meeting groups in some English speaking areas here in the US, that problem can certainly be remedied by printing an inexpensive BB word glossary as a handout. If the District already has taken a survey and knows which words seem to be the most problematic for most (edit) some members in its area, it seems that something like a word glossary handout would be a cheap, quick fix and the best way to go.
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Re: Heard at the District Meeting!

Postby Lali » Wed Apr 06, 2016 8:08 pm

editted - then I deleted your post as it was a quote ~ Paige
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Step 2: He can
Step 3: I think I'll let him
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Re: Heard at the District Meeting!

Postby Chelle » Wed Apr 06, 2016 8:52 pm

*
Last edited by Chelle on Sun Apr 17, 2016 6:50 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Heard at the District Meeting!

Postby kdub720 » Wed Apr 06, 2016 11:10 pm

Great write. This has boggled my mind for a long time. AA works. The Big Book is rad. Yet we are pushing 100 years. The wording in the book and the style of the meetings way out dated. I like old style reading, yet the meetings kill me. that is why I am here, I want to talk and need suport yet can not handle traveling to meeting to here 45 minutes of fluff and ten minutes of meaningful dialouge.
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Re: Heard at the District Meeting!

Postby ezdzit247 » Thu Apr 07, 2016 12:46 pm

According to a 2015 study by the U.S. Department of Education and the National Institute of Literacy, 32 million adults in the U.S. can't read. That's 14 percent of the population. 21 percent of adults in just the U.S. A previous 2003 study by the National Center for Education Statistics (NCES) produced estimates of the percentage of US adults who were functionally literate but were lacking in Basic Prose Literacy Skills (BPLS). The percentage of adults who had problems understanding words grouped together in phrases in my state, California, was 23% or about 9 million people. I was really surprised to read how severe the literacy problem was in the US and shocked at the percentages for my own state. Reviewing this info helped me to understand why BB Study meetings I've attended over the years are generally small (6-12 people) and why meetings in which only a few members are called upon to read anything out loud, like topic discussion and speaker meetings, draw room capacity crowds.

I don't think rewriting the BB or passing out dictionaries or even providing word glossaries at meetings is going to be useful to the millions prospective newcomer alcoholics who can't read period or can read words but don't have the skills to understand words group together in sentences. I wonder if switching to playing AA's audio version of the Big Book at BB study meeting might eliminate the potential of embarrassment for AA members who have literacy problems, especially newcomers?

Keep coming back....
Last edited by ezdzit247 on Fri Apr 08, 2016 11:39 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Heard at the District Meeting!

Postby Stepchild » Thu Apr 07, 2016 4:15 pm

When all else fails...Back it up with a survey. Do you think there is the remote possibility that seeing how the book was written almost 80 years ago that the language used may be dated? It was recommended to me to use a dictionary while reading the book...Preferably an older one and it was a most valuable suggestion. I make the same suggestion to anyone new.
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Re: Heard at the District Meeting!

Postby whipping post » Thu Apr 07, 2016 7:00 pm


I would suggest that anyone to whom the phrase "educationally challenged" seems derogatory, offensive, etc, take the time to google the phrase .


If I don't want to use a dictionary to understand the true meaning of the Big Book then I sure don't want to use google to decipher a post on a message board. :lol:

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Re: Heard at the District Meeting!

Postby jjconcepts » Thu Apr 07, 2016 7:51 pm

This is a very good topic. when new to AA I was very frustrated with the program until I found other books not written by AA and their take and various stories and approach to the 12 steps and chapter concepts as individually understood by the anonomys writers. I wouldn't change a book that works, but an accessible version that relates, references and offers suggestions / personal understandings of the steps and chaptrrs, AA approved would be invaluable. one could, as I did. read the easier to digest books, referencing the big book and it's chapter concepts and steps as they are and allow a foothold into a program that appears complex at first and simplicity options may save a few more lives in the early stages.
I credit those other books for early sobriety in the approachable, identifiable manner introducing the big book's critically valuable text. Continue adding subtracting stories but the core should stay and allow individuals to personal take their own away.
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