Deplorables

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Re: Deplorables

Postby Duke » Sun Jan 22, 2017 4:48 pm

When I encounter people like this, I pray for them, turn them over, and set a better example.

You can't control them. Don't let them control you.

Best of luck.
"If you are humble nothing will touch you, neither praise nor disgrace, because you know what you are.", Mother Teresa
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Re: Deplorables

Postby positrac » Mon Jan 23, 2017 2:48 am

You've mentioned that you have mobility issues or disability and I say you have some choices:
1) find another meeting location
2) stop going all together and do you AA stuff online.

The world ain't perfect and people who should know better don't and those who expect otherwise might be equally to blame. Lastly if you have issues why not voice it and show them you aren't liking the message. Equality is a two way street and being PC doesn't pay and it is has been known to be highly over-rated.

I am on nobodies side except be responsible and speak up and mean what you say. Worst thing to happen is you don't go back. And like I suggested in several posts ago is find others in the community who suffer with addiction and start a meeting at someone's home as when more than one meet it is a meeting.
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Re: Deplorables

Postby michmjon » Tue Jan 24, 2017 10:38 am

What I can't believe is that the women attending these meetings just shrug it off and sometimes laugh about it. If some guy ever said anything like what I hear to my sister, they would find themselves on the ground, grabbing their crotch and writhing in pain. When I heard one of these "gentlemen" mutter the word "Faggot" and look in my direction it was all I could do not to walk over to him and punch him right in the face- but I'm not that way. I just gave him the evil eye and walked away. The other morning I chaired a meeting and before I started, I made my feelings known about what I thought about such behavior and said flat-out that if it happened again while I was present, words would be spoken and those words would not be kind. I said "When you say something like that to another person, it shows your true character and I doubt anyone would want to live their life with others thinking of them in that way." A few heads looked down to the floor as I was talking- they knew I was talking about them. Well, it seemed to have sunk in until this morning when one of the older gentlemen made a comment about the women who attended the March on Washington this past Saturday. I can't help to believe that these men have somehow felt empowered by the things our President (with a camera pointed right at him) has said about women, minorities a those of other faiths.
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Re: Deplorables

Postby Noels » Tue Jan 24, 2017 12:34 pm

They're probably harmless hon. All talk and no action. Just ignore them. You did well by speaking your truth. Remember we cant change what others do or say but we CAN control our reaction / response to it. Let them dream on if it keeps them going. Poor sods.
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Re: Deplorables

Postby Spirit Flower » Tue Jan 24, 2017 1:29 pm

the women attending these meetings just shrug it off and sometimes laugh about it.
Don't take this passive response for approval or acceptance. It could be fear. It could be stuffing their reaction rather than try to fight with obvious axxholes.
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Re: Deplorables

Postby Noels » Tue Jan 24, 2017 2:30 pm

Or it could be that they really don't care? What are the words of Mother Theresa on Duke's signature? "If you are humble nothing will touch you, neither praise nor disgrace, because you know what you are."

Always keep that possibility in mind also.

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Re: Deplorables

Postby michmjon » Tue Jan 24, 2017 8:50 pm

"They're probably harmless hon. All talk and no action. Just ignore them. You did well by speaking your truth. Remember we cant change what others do or say but we CAN control our reaction / response to it. Let them dream on if it keeps them going. Poor sods.
Mwah xxx Noels"

No, no, no. They are not just harmless and you are VERY WRONG SAYING THEY ARE HARMLESS AND SHOULD JUST BE IGNORED. Every time they say something to a woman, a minority, or anyone else that degrades or objectifies that person, they are chipping away at that person's self esteem. I know. I've been there. For years I just smiled and shrugged off jokes and barbs made at me because of my sexuality. Pretty soon you begin to think that "hey, maybe they're right- maybe I am a "stupid faggot," a worthless piece of crap that can't find a girlfriend so he has to turns to guys for satisfaction. No girl would want me anyway."

Poor sods is right. Poor sods that boost their egos and get satisfaction and a good laugh at the expense of others. By shrugging them off and ignoring their behavior you are only empowering them to keep up with that behavior. You are encouraging them to be what AA refers to as DRY DRUNKS.
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Re: Deplorables

Postby Noels » Tue Jan 24, 2017 11:16 pm

Hi Mich, if that's how you feel about it then you need to take the necessary action because then it is part of 'your recovery ' - part of 'your journey ' to self healing. It also fall under this part of the serenity prayer - 'to change the things we can ' - being so passionate about it you truly believe you can "change the things we can" and by believing that - you can! Didn't I say to you a while ago that you are exactly where you are supposed to be? Good for you. Good for your fighting spirit. As ive said before - just be true to yourself. That is all that is required to heal.

Now lets take it a little bit further -
Look at your response - the parts which I placed in bold in particular
No, no, no. They are not just harmless and you are VERY WRONG SAYING THEY ARE HARMLESS AND SHOULD JUST BE IGNORED. Every time they say something to a woman, a minority, or anyone else that degrades or objectifies that person, they are chipping away at that person's self esteem. I know. I've been there. For years I just smiled and shrugged off jokes and barbs made at me because of my sexuality. Pretty soon you begin to think that "hey, maybe they're right- maybe I am a "stupid faggot," a worthless piece of crap that can't find a girlfriend so he has to turns to guys for satisfaction. No girl would want me anyway."
Part of healing is realizing that what we see in the world - especially the not acceptables, is always a pointer to where we as individuals need to start within ourselves for healing to take place. So in short, what you are seeing as "not acceptable and hurting these women" is actually your own pain coming forward. I have always said that this is about ourselves. Our individual journeys. Our individual healing - the "me" and ive taken a lot of criticism for that from some members but when one know the truth you stand by it. Regardless of the human consequence or reaction.

So good for you. The fact that you have noticed what is going on in the group and have decided that it is unacceptable and are speaking your truth about it indicates progress to me. You are being truthful to yourself and rather than keeping it in - For years I just smiled and shrugged off jokes and barbs made at me because of my sexuality. - you are taking a stand. For yourself and possibly to change things for the better for others.

Well done. Keep what you're doing and thanks for sharing your journey with us.
Have an awesome day and know that you are loved.
Lotsa Love and Light
Mwah xxx Noels
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Re: Deplorables

Postby positrac » Wed Jan 25, 2017 6:43 am

michmjon wrote:What I can't believe is that the women attending these meetings just shrug it off and sometimes laugh about it. If some guy ever said anything like what I hear to my sister, they would find themselves on the ground, grabbing their crotch and writhing in pain. When I heard one of these "gentlemen" mutter the word "Faggot" and look in my direction it was all I could do not to walk over to him and punch him right in the face- but I'm not that way. I just gave him the evil eye and walked away. The other morning I chaired a meeting and before I started, I made my feelings known about what I thought about such behavior and said flat-out that if it happened again while I was present, words would be spoken and those words would not be kind. I said "When you say something like that to another person, it shows your true character and I doubt anyone would want to live their life with others thinking of them in that way." A few heads looked down to the floor as I was talking- they knew I was talking about them. Well, it seemed to have sunk in until this morning when one of the older gentlemen made a comment about the women who attended the March on Washington this past Saturday. I can't help to believe that these men have somehow felt empowered by the things our President (with a camera pointed right at him) has said about women, minorities a those of other faiths.


Remember just because we got sober doesn't mean we sprout wings and become saints..... We should however change for the better and lead by example and IMO I am glad you spoke up and at least made it known your feelings and or impression. I was told to stick with the winners and I'll become a different person. Just because I am long timer doesn't prevent me from life and stuff inside life. When I visit NYC I see old friends and people from the rooms and we cut up in the NY manner and it is crass and at times nasty. But to take that out in a meeting we don't and we do it outside and just let some steam off.
About the politics the media has spun a stinky turd on that women issue because if we forget the Clintons and that ever famous quote: "I did not have sexual relations with that woman, Miss Lewinsky." So this part of recovery and outside issues should be left out as it is not our place to make points. Just saying we might need to be a bit more above the hype as it is over rated.
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Re: Deplorables

Postby Noels » Wed Jan 25, 2017 7:26 am

I can't help to believe that these men have somehow felt empowered by the things our President (with a camera pointed right at him) has said about women, minorities a those of other faiths.

And to be really honest, those words were spoken a very long time ago. Now, I don't know about you guys but I said a lot of things years ago which, when I remember them today makes me cringe. People change. We become wiser as we get older (well ... most of us :D I just became wiser :lol: ) That's the beauty of being human - we change, adapt, learn and survive. And to tie it in with our AA message the words "and this too shall pass"

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Re: Deplorables

Postby positrac » Wed Jan 25, 2017 8:36 am

Ditto Noels ^^^
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Re: Deplorables

Postby tomsteve » Thu Jan 26, 2017 12:57 pm

ditto positracs ditto
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Re: Deplorables

Postby Lali » Thu Jan 26, 2017 9:40 pm

Mich, I want to tell you that as a woman, I WOULD NOT allow a man to degrade me! I would absolutely put them in their place. At the same time, I would not allow the remarks of an ignorant old fart to affect my self-esteem. If that is the case, these women sorely need to work on their self-esteem issues!!!

Good for you for speaking up about your feelings for being called those horrible names. Keep standing up for your rights to be treated with respect. I have to admit that it ruffles my feathers to hear what some of those
"gentlemen" have said to you. It's totally unacceptable. And for the record, I am a straight woman so I have no "dogs in this fight", just an advocate for human rights.

BTW, to set the record straight, it was Hillary Clinton that used the word "deplorables" to describe those that were backing Trump.
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Re: Deplorables

Postby ezdzit247 » Sat Jan 28, 2017 3:12 pm

HI michmjon

Thanks for the topic and thank you for speaking up about the inappropriate and very unacceptable behavior you observed to other members in your meeting groups. Here's a link to an AA publication that addresses this issue:

Safety and A.A.: Our Common Welfare

Safety is an important issue within A.A. — one that all groups and members can address to develop workable solutions and help keep our meetings safe based on the fundamental principles of the Fellowship.....

Dealing with Disruptions

While most groups operate with a healthy balance of spontaneity and structure, there are a number of situations that can threaten group unity and challenge the safety of the group and its members. Often this can center on disruptive individuals, those who are confrontational, aggressive, or those who are simply unwilling to put the needs of the group first. Such behavior can hijack the focus of a meeting and frighten members, new and old....


http://www.aa.org/assets/en_US/smf-209_en.pdf.
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Re: Deplorables

Postby Lali » Sat Jan 28, 2017 9:51 pm

Mich, I have a lot of respect for you for standing up for your rights and the rights of others. From everything I have read that you have shared, I truly think the answer is to start a new meeting. It sounds like a new meeting is sorely needed in your area so your new group can get down to the business of TALKING RECOVERY and not have to deal with this BS. You have stated your mind and now, perhaps, it's time to move on! IMO, you would be doing a great service for your community!
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