The fun of Alcohol Withdrawal Syndrome (noob)

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tyg
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Re: The fun of Alcohol Withdrawal Syndrome (noob)

Post by tyg »

Why not choose your own conception of God?

I let the God thing keep me from giving this program an honest try but the destruction and beating of El King Alcohol had me running right back in with a new attitude that put ALL my prejudices aside and try something that just might work; because nothing else had.

My drinking career in a nutshell:

In the beginning….
I never had control...Humiliations, demoralization's would happen occasionally but it never occurred to me to…Just Not Drink. My brain told me, I must modify somehow and then I won't get into these troubles (drink on a full stomach, only drink at home, never on the job, drink beer, not whiskey etc.)

As the illness progressed…
The humiliations, demoralization's continued, got more frequent. I began to make promises to stop drinking. But, sooner or later, I always drank again. Always!

Alcoholism keeps progressing…
The realization finally hit me...Need to stop drinking but how?!? I can not stop no matter what!! Alcohol was my master, my God, I hated and worshiped it.

So broken and hopeless I came back to AA...
I just do now all that is suggested: Alcohol is but a symptom...I had to get down to causes and conditions. I got a recovered alcoholic to show me how

Alcoholics Anonymous says, pg 30
The idea that somehow, someday he will control and enjoy his drinking is the great obsession of every abnormal drinker. Their persistence of this illusion is astonishing. Many pursue it into the gates of insanity or death.
~ We alcoholics are men & women who have lost the ability to control our drinking. We know that no real alcoholic ever recovers control.

Welcome to Alcoholics Anonymous... hope you will join us as we trudge the road to happy destiny together. Sobriety ROCKS! It's the new and improved way to paarteeey!! :mrgreen: :lol: :mrgreen:
~The secret to the AA program is the first three words on page 112~

bum
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Re: The fun of Alcohol Withdrawal Syndrome (noob)

Post by bum »

Why do I need to have a conception of god? What if I don't want one? What if, by my own intelligence and thought, I have viewed the pain and misery of life and decided that there is no god.. well, not one that cares about the pains that us humans suffer anyhow...Why do some people get to live a great life while others suffer? Read the news lately? People in some small villages are stuck during an earthquake or other natural disaster and some people are kidnapped and held for slavery and then left adrift at sea if that does not work out for the kidnappers..

Sometimes I feel sorry for myself.. because my life has never been easy... I don't get to have girlfriends and dates because I don't have those kind of looks... I was not given that gift of being attractive, like some guys have...but at least I have a bed to sleep in.. and live in a house.. so many people in our world don't even get to have that....
This is my signature! Deal with it!... ok.. I just couldn't think of anything cool to put here... give me time...

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PaigeB
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Re: The fun of Alcohol Withdrawal Syndrome (noob)

Post by PaigeB »

Hi Bum. I am an alcoholic and an atheist. Those 2 issues haven't really interfered with my living happily and healthily in Alcoholics Anonymous. I was gripped with "pitiful and incomprehensible demoralization" (ironically, this spells PAID) when I got here. I saw that others were living happy healthy lives and I figured they would say, "Get on your knees and pray - IF you want want we have!"

I am glad they did not do that. They told me that the worldwide fellowship of AA seemed to be more power than me and it was great it I wanted to choose that as a power greater than me. I didn't go for electricity or the door knob since I can easily manipulate those things. But here was a room full of people had some solutions. I did not believe in an interactive entity, so I had to figure out what they were DOING.

I haven't found it necessary to take a drink in over 5 years - because I DID WHAT THEY DID, sans the kneeling prayers... I focussed on meditation instead. But I got a sponsor and I worked the Steps with that sponsor and I sponsor other women now. THERE IS HOPE here.

I earned my seat at these tables - I PAID.
Cling to the thought that, in God's hands, the dark past is the greatest possession you have - the key to life and happiness for others. With it you can avert death and misery for them. page 124 BB

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Tosh
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Re: The fun of Alcohol Withdrawal Syndrome (noob)

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bum wrote:Why do I need to have a conception of god?
For spiritual reasons, which I can explain if someone's interested,I think that's an excellent idea. You don't need one if you don't want to.

And lucky for people like us, the 12 Step program is a program of action; not a program of concepts or beliefs.

I know I could sit about all day, drinking, browsing the internet, (I can do that sober too :lol: ), but really, I only started to recover from my alcoholism when I started putting some effort - taking actions - into my life. But what actions to take? Well that was easy to work out in early sobriety, I had to move my arse to a meeting. And then another, and then another.

I heard people talking about 'doing service' at meetings, so I volunteered for some service and made tea and coffee for the other alkies. It made me feel part of A.A., rather than just a visitor. I also heard people talking about sponsors, so I got myself one of them. He showed me what other actions to take which sorted out my 'God problem' (it's not a problem).

I guess my point is, if you wish to make 'God' a hurdle to recovery, then you can, but it doesn't have to be that way. And the emphasis of a 12 Step program is taking action, regardless of whether we want to take them or not; we just do it. It's one of them 'simple not easy' things, but considering that my concept of myself (prior to A.A.) was that I was just a 'weak man', if I can do it, I'm guessing most can. I just did it in little bites, one step at a time, and it all began with getting off my arse and going to a meeting.

I hope you do too.
Come, come, whoever you are. Wanderer, worshiper, lover of leaving. It doesn't matter. Ours is not a caravan of despair. Come, even if you have broken your vows a thousand times. Come, yet again, come, come.” Rumi (No sniggering from the sex addicts)

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Re: The fun of Alcohol Withdrawal Syndrome (noob)

Post by Lali »

Tosh wrote:I guess my point is, if you wish to make 'God' a hurdle to recovery, then you can, but it doesn't have to be that way.
Excellent point!
Step 1: I can't
Step 2: He can
Step 3: I think I'll let him

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ezdzit247
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Re: The fun of Alcohol Withdrawal Syndrome (noob)

Post by ezdzit247 »

bum wrote:Why do I need to have a conception of god? What if I don't want one? What if, by my own intelligence and thought, I have viewed the pain and misery of life and decided that there is no god.. well, not one that cares about the pains that us humans suffer anyhow.. Why do some people get to live a great life while others suffer?
I can really identify with that line of reasoning. My experience was I didn't need a "conception of god" and didn't want one. As long as I had enough booze and it was still working to take away the "pain and the misery of life", I didn't need anyone or anything else, especially a god. What I didn't realize at the time was that I had made booze my god. What happened to me was that eventually booze stopped working for me. It stopped taking away my pain and misery and started causing it. It stopped being the solution and became the problem. And, even when I was able to admit that to myself, I couldn't stop drinking, couldn't stop trying to make booze do for me what it used to do. When I tried and was able to resist the craving for a few days or weeks on my own will power, and fool myself into believing that I'd finally beat it and was safe, once I picked up that first drink again, and I always did, I could not resist the craving for more booze. I bounced in and out of AA for almost two years trying to battle my drinking problem on my own. A 10 day black out binge and a family intervention finally landed me a stay in a recovery house run by AA members. While I was there, I had an extraordinary experience that completely eradicated my craving for booze and enabled me to go back to AA meetings with a new attitude and a new kind of craving...to grow and learn. I have come to believe that is what this thing called life is all about...growing and learning.

My response to your question,
"Why do I need to have a conception of god?"
is that my experience is that you don't need one. All I needed was a concept of a power greater than myself other than booze. I know what worked and didn't work for me. I don't know, can't know, and don't presume to know what will or won't work for you or anybody else.

Keep coming back....
“To laugh often and much; to win the respect of intelligent people and the affection of children...to leave the world a better place...to know even one life has breathed easier because you have lived. This is to have succeeded.” -- Ralph Waldo Emerson

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johnd
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Re: The fun of Alcohol Withdrawal Syndrome (noob)

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Hi Bum and Welcome to our little forum ,
Here we can take a bad day and turn it into a great day. You know why?? Because we share a common thread known as alcoholism.. We all came from different backgrounds and circumstances, You could say we were like on an island of misfits, yet we found out we lacked the power to drink like so called normal social drinkers. Yes I tried everyway to be able to drink and walk a way from it. But, the problem is I'm an alcoholic who can't have one drink.. The old saying "One is too many and a thousand isn't enough". That is what happened to me.. I'm not rich, I never married. I came from a home where everyone drank and fought ... My father died from alcoholism at the age of 37 I was 4 months old... How unfair... We moved constantly when I was a child 12 times I can count my siblings remember several more times. I was picked on in school. The butt of jokes with my so called friends. Yet that wasn't fair now was it. I drank not to kill the pain of the past I drank to just fit in... I wanted to be accepted by anyone ... Then I tried to stop drinking by going on the wagon so to speak .. I be lucky if I could go a week myself. Then trouble came into my life How unfair. Everyone was picking on me..... How unfair... Then I got sick and tired of being sick and tired .. I sought help to stop drinking. I wanted the insanity to stop..... I got Sober For me... the Fight was over.. I have finally surrendered .. It wasn't life that was unfair it was me who wouldn't be fair to me, Life didn't cheat me and created my alcoholism. I created I picked up that first drink so long ago..... Now I am sober over 28 years because I opened my eyes and ears and listened to the people who got what I always wanted.. Sobriety and a life second to none.... I hope you keep coming Bum I really do. Good Luck to you.... John D.
Life is what happens while you're busy making other plans- Anonymous

Lali
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Re: The fun of Alcohol Withdrawal Syndrome (noob)

Post by Lali »

I'm reading some good stuff here. When you mentioned "surrender", John, it reminded me of this little ditty:

Surrender to Win!
Step 1: I can't
Step 2: He can
Step 3: I think I'll let him

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Layne
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Re: The fun of Alcohol Withdrawal Syndrome (noob)

Post by Layne »

bum wrote:What if, by my own intelligence and thought, I have viewed the pain and misery of life and decided that there is no god.. well, not one that cares about the pains that us humans suffer anyhow...
If there is a god, what makes me think my intelligence and thought could be brilliant enough to understand the reasoning behind god's actions or inactions. Maybe he should dumb things down enough so that I could grasp them.

If there is no god, there are still powers at work that are greater than my intelligence, thought, and comprehension; which by the way are usually vastly over rated by myself because they qualified me for my seat in the rooms of AA in the first place. So what the hell do I know anyway?!!! My cranium is not always my best source for answers.

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Re: The fun of Alcohol Withdrawal Syndrome (noob)

Post by BPG »

Layne wrote:If there is a god, what makes me think my intelligence and thought could be brilliant enough to understand the reasoning behind god's actions or inactions. Maybe he should dumb things down enough so that I could grasp them.

If there is no god, there are still powers at work that are greater than my intelligence, thought, and comprehension; which by the way are usually vastly over rated by myself because they qualified me for my seat in the rooms of AA in the first place. So what the hell do I know anyway?!!! My cranium is not always my best source for answers.
Yes, exactly, but I'd go one step further; what ARE those 'powers at work'. if not 'God'? Our thinking (mine especially) tends to get discombobulated on this question, but I think this is because we are forever trying to force-fit God into a concept. Where I've landed on the question is simply to define 'God' as a 'higher purpose', because if there IS a higher purpose (a reason for being) it is either God or the handiwork of God. That's why I believe that, when you drill down deep enough, there really are no atheists, since even most self-described atheists believe that their lives have some meaning (or purpose). Virtually all of us have HOPE, and as Emerson said to the skeptic, 'We hope; you must explain why.'

In other words, it's not that we have hope because we believe in God; it's that we believe in God because we have hope!

Of course, what we find in AA --- at least what I found --- is the humility to free us from having to figure all this stuff out. (Even so, it is kind of fun!)

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Re: The fun of Alcohol Withdrawal Syndrome (noob)

Post by Tosh »

BPG wrote: That's why I believe that, when you drill down deep enough, there really are no atheists, since even most self-described atheists believe that their lives have some meaning (or purpose).
I could call myself agnostic, but I'm agnostic in the same way a Christian is agnostic about Odin, Wodin, Thor, or any number of the hundreds-of-thousands of other 'gods' man has created.

As for 'meaning', well each of us ascribes that to our lives. It does not necessarily have to come from some deity. I ascribe to the one offered by A.A.; I'm to stay sober and help other alcoholics achieve sobriety. That's the meaning to my life! Given that my previous primary purpose was to make myself happy regardless of anyone else, I now understand how that ended up with me being suicidal and at my first A.A. meeting.

Still, in the pin-hole of our own heads, we're entitled to believe what we want. But I can assure you that atheist can, and do, have meaning to their lives yet still not believe in a deity, and it would be extremely arrogant and narrow minded to think otherwise.

Oh, and for the record, my father believed in a traditional concept of God and he still died a fairly typical alcoholic's death (alone, in poverty, and young). That shows me that there's a heck of a lot more to this thing than belief, but luckily enough A.A.'s program puts it's emphasis on action, hence we have 'a program of action', not a 'program of beliefs'.
Come, come, whoever you are. Wanderer, worshiper, lover of leaving. It doesn't matter. Ours is not a caravan of despair. Come, even if you have broken your vows a thousand times. Come, yet again, come, come.” Rumi (No sniggering from the sex addicts)

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Re: The fun of Alcohol Withdrawal Syndrome (noob)

Post by Reborn »

A simple way I like to put this higher power thing is I have faith that there is a power greater than me and faith in the AA program.


Faith is not belief without proof but trust without reservation!
We have recovered, and have been given the power to help others. BB pg 132

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Re: The fun of Alcohol Withdrawal Syndrome (noob)

Post by BPG »

Tosh wrote:As for 'meaning', well each of us ascribes that to our lives. It does not necessarily have to come from some deity. I ascribe to the one offered by A.A.; I'm to stay sober and help other alcoholics achieve sobriety. That's the meaning to my life! Given that my previous primary purpose was to make myself happy regardless of anyone else, I now understand how that ended up with me being suicidal and at my first A.A. meeting.
I'm sorry. I didn't explain myself very well. The point I was trying to make was that the existence of a higher purpose --- define it how we will --- is, in itself, a way to define a deity.

That's what I mean when I suggest that perhaps there is very little real difference between atheists, agnostics and believers.

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